Never Forgotten, A Memorial Day Tribute

Speaker 1: 1:02

Hello everybody, this is a a very deserving and important episode. Steve and I are going to record just the two of us. Today We're going to. We're going to talk about some, some true military heroes, and this is our Memorial Day episode. Steve, come up with a beautiful name for it.

Speaker 2: 1:27

Never forgotten. Memorial Day tribute.

Speaker 1: 1:31

And so that's. That's what today is. This is going to drop on May 26th so that you all can listen, and you know you're already. You're already going to be. If you're listening to this podcast, odds are you're already going to be memorializing a veteran in some way, shape or form that has passed. But now you get to listen to a podcast and learn about a couple other guys You might want to add into your prayers and your your thoughts on this Memorial.

Speaker 2: 1:58

Day, absolutely, absolutely, absolutely. So if, if I can start, go ahead, take a moment, just one moment, to remember someone who served in the armed forces of this great country and made the ultimate sacrifice. A lot of people have a misunderstanding of what Monday is. First of all, they think it's a day off entitled to them, the official start of swimming and grilling season. They say things like happy Memorial Day and thank you for your service.

Speaker 2: 2:44

Decoration Day, as it was known after the Civil War, is a day to recognize, clean and decorate the graves of those veterans who died during war. Memorial Day, as Decoration Day gradually came to be known as, has been a federal holiday since 1971, with the honor extended to veterans who served in the military and the military. I do not need a particular day to think about. First Lieutenant Carlos Diaz. Staff Sergeant Harrison Brown. Staff Sergeant Michael Moody Jr. Staff Sergeant James Snyder. Sergeant Dane Duff, dane Donnellal, corporal Marvin Snyder, pfc Gregory Huxley Jr. I will place flags in my front yard in honor of those and the 388 more of the members of the Third Infantry Division I served with who fell in efforts to pursue the end of the global war on Terrell. You may ask me. Well, i cook out god damn right partaking a beverage of choice. Yep, i will enjoy my day because so many since 1776 afford me that opportunity. I will also take a moment to wish those who truly deserve it happy Memorial Day.

Speaker 1: 4:47

I mean that has pretty powerful right there. You know you doing being the Air Force guy and on the flight line and stuff on, and you know when I was there and not leaving the wire really didn't have a lot of battlefield casualties or anything like that. So my personal connection to Memorial Day is very lacking in comparison to you. But that's my personal connection, right. But I also understand. I appreciate, coming from a family with a lot of veterans on down the lines and through the generations, i understand the importance of it and you said it best. You know everybody that fell since 1776, they paid the price for me to have, if I was working, to have a day off on Monday. It's not entitled to me. Someone earned it for me, it's. you know I got a thing that I post usually every Memorial Day and it's it's. don't thank me for my service on Memorial Day. This isn't my day. I didn't do anything to warrant this day. You want to thank me? Thank me in November on Veterans Day. But you know the wife. so the wife and I graduated from the same high school. She was a couple of years younger than me. She graduated, she was very good friends with and graduated with a guy. His name is Raymond border. I knew of Ray. I didn't know Ray, but anything I've ever heard about Ray super solid dude. He was a CB based out of Mississippi, chief Petty Officer in the Navy And on October 19th Damn, if I don't remember the year now he passed or he was killed in Pactica province in Afghanistan doing route clearance, ied stuff like that. Ray was a solid dude. Everybody loved him. Family loved him. You know my wife was devastated when she heard. the community really, you know, opened their arms to Ray when he came home to be laid to rest Section of the highway, you know, coming out of Kishoktons, the Ray Raymond border Memorial Highway. the gym down in Biloxi, i believe, has been renamed the Raymond border fitness center, you know.

Speaker 1: 7:39

so before we did this, i contacted Ray's sister and I said Hey. I said you know I'm brandy's husband. you know I cohost a podcast. We're going to be doing our Memorial Day episode. I'd really like to say a little bit about Ray, if that's all right. And she says absolutely. I said well, i'd like to make sure your parents are okay with it as well. And they said yeah, and the wife's like you could have just done it. I'm like you're right, i could have, i said, but they're a gold star family. There's no higher sacrifice a family can pay to this country as losing a loved one, a son, a daughter, a father, a brother. Um, and gold star families deserve our utmost respect because, you know, they have to look every day at Memorial Day as a reminder, along with all the other things that they have that are reminders that their brother's not there, their son's not there, and, and I would have, i would have been devastated if they would have thought that they wanted to bring up Ray purely for exploitation. Um, and that's not what it was about. I just want people to know that in every little town you know, because I'm from a small town every little town that you're in, there's somebody from that town that owes your appreciation for Memorial Day.

Speaker 1: 9:09

Um, and I asked Shana, i said, is there anything that you would like me to say about Ray that you know is not out there and all the new sources and stuff like that? And she sent me this little picture and it's uh, it's Ray standing next to some guys. you know, like I said, he was a CB. He was real big into fitness and stuff like that. That's why they renamed the gym.

Speaker 1: 10:00

When he got to that place in Afghanistan, they didn't have a gym. So, ray, using his CB skills, um, he built them. When I say built them a gym, he didn't build them a building, he actually built gym equipment. And so the picture Shana sent me is this wooden incline bench, that's, you know, it moves and it's got the racks and everything on it, you know. and and it's the guy that, just you know, showed up at a place in Afghanistan and they're like Hey, we can't work out. and he's like Bullshit, we're going to work out and I'm going to figure out a way to do it. And he did. So. I mean, i know it doesn't sound like a lot compared to what a lot of other guys have done, but that was important to her. And because it was important to her, you know, i wanted to share that little story about Ray.

Speaker 2: 10:49

Yeah, i mean it's, it's. you know, i used to tell people, um, if freedom wasn't free, what did you pay? And you know it kind of brings it to the front of you know, a lot of the narrative, um, nowadays is about freedoms and what people's interpretation of those freedoms are. And, uh, no matter how, no matter how you view your freedoms, that they were um, a lot of people say, you know, um, the second amendment is a God given right. And I refute that, not because I'm a nonbeliever, because God didn't give us a right to bear arms, but God was there. And that's not saying, you know, veterans are better. But it's not a God given right, it's not. It is a right that is given through blood, through sacrifice, through men and women who stood out front and said not today. And we said that to enemies of this country for 248 years. And that is what this day is about For me. You know I've brought it, you know I brought him up before and no better episode to revisit I'm. Earlier I said um Corporal Marvin Snyder.

Speaker 2: 13:12

Um, marvin Snyder was my sister's father. He was born 327 1950. He died in Vietnam in June 25th 1970. My, my sister, was born February 15th of that year He was able to see her born And then, soon thereafter, got on a plane and went to Vietnam and went to Vietnam And, within a few months, died, serving, defending his country and the populace of South Vietnam. Not a, not a popular war, but you know he's one of many who answered that call and went forth to close and destroy the enemy. And on that day, uh, he fell and, uh, you know I've told the story before um about the impact that finding the folded flag, finding his metals in a cardboard box that my sister had in her room, um, the impact on me that when, when I was able to put the pieces together, that without Marvin D Snyder's sacrifice, there is no Steve Vickers, there is no me.

Speaker 2: 15:13

and you know what? um, the least I can do, um, the very least I can do, is remember him on Memorial Day. Um and uh, you know I am. I lived in. I lived in a household where, um military service was not looked upon highly. No flag was flown out in front of my house, no, um, you know, we didn't attend parades and things of that nature because of the pain, because of, you know um it was hard for your mom.

Speaker 2: 16:13

Yeah, and and um, we never, we never had um conversations. Uh, even, you know, even when recruiters started recruiting me, it was just hell. No, you know, um, absolutely not. And so.

Speaker 1: 16:37

So Marvin was 12, 20 when he died. Yeah, your mom would have had to have been right about same age, right? Yep, yep, that's a lot to deal with, yep.

Speaker 2: 16:45

And and you know it's, it's one of those things where, especially the time you're, she was promised a lot of things. Um, you know, um my sister, my dad never adopted my sister because of you know the the, the implications that would happen. Uh, down the road um college, you know she, she qualified for the Ohio war orphan scholarship, uh, things of that nature. So, um she, my dad always treated her like a child, uh, like his child, not a child. Um, she's 50 now, so, um, but yeah, he always treated her like his child but understood that. You know um her, her dad paid the ultimate sacrifice and you know, and I think it it took my service to allow her to appreciate the service of men and women of this country. Again, um, she, again her, her dad's metals and and flag and and all that stuff were in in a box, um in in her closet for years And uh, you know it's. It's just been probably in the last 10 years that she displays that in her house now. And uh, you know you look online and and he was part of um Alpha company.

Speaker 2: 18:45

Uh, first of the 506, um 101st airborne Um and where where things parallel is when I was in Korea in 2002, um, my, my company supported first of the 506. And uh, i was, i was giving, uh, i was given a coin um by the battalion commander, for you know some things, and it's the same coin they had in 1970. It's, it's, i mean it's, and uh. So I gave it to her, um and um, yeah, and I supported the 101st Um, i was attached to the 101st in Iraq. So there there's parallels, right, there's um it.

Speaker 1: 19:43

It kind of reinforces your thought process that you're going to honor Marvin service by doing what? you did by serving, So yeah.

Speaker 2: 19:55

And and and, as I said before, it was a debt owed. Yep, um, i felt it, then I feel it, you know it's. You know, if your existence is strictly, you know um, based off of someone's sacrifice, what do you do with that? I mean, you know, what do you do with that?

Speaker 1: 20:17

So, um, and yeah, you can't take that sacrifice for granted.

Speaker 2: 20:23

No, And and but. That's what. That's what this day is about. Uh, that sacrifice in in all the others. You know all the other lives that were cut short, all the others. You know um, we did that ride um to um.

Speaker 1: 20:43

Illinois. Yeah, illinois last year to the mid East conflict wall man And uh what, what a great ride, what a great place, um yeah, i've, i've said before I don't I, i don't I, I, i, i can um understand what the Vietnam guys feel when they go to their wall, but I never experienced it until we got to go to our wall. Yeah, such a such a heavy, heavy place, heavy so heavy, yeah, and and uh, so, um, yeah, it was.

Speaker 2: 21:30

You get to uh, you know they have the, the, the etchings where you get to trace names, and we did that. Spent, spent, a lot of all the names I read off um, um, uh, earlier, except for Marvin's, we, we traced them, um and uh, yeah, it was, it was such a such a great, such a great, uh time, time to it was an amazing experience. Yeah, such a great time to to spend the day, memorial day weekend, at that wall, at that place and, and you know, do nothing but remember those um.

Speaker 1: 22:14

Yeah, Brandy got a couple of rubbings of raised name off the wall, So you give it to his sister and his parents. Yeah, So they could, you know, have something. You know they could visualize that. You know it. I'm paraphrasing cause I'm a fuck. This quote up, but you're never truly gone, if you're not forgotten, Right, And and? so now they can see, in Ottawa, Illinois, there's a wall and their son's name is engraved in that wall and it'll be there for now, until whenever. You know, same thing with those. There are like 50,000 names on that wall in Washington.

Speaker 2: 22:51

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 22:52

Uh yeah, and and uh, there's a ride this weekend up in Washington Um, we do a ride up in um out of Kent that goes into, uh, i believe, maslin. That's where the Ohio wall is. Um, everyone who fell from Ohio is on a wall up there. Also, up in um Sunbury there's a wall for um um all all the um Iraq and Afghanistan, um members who fell. There's a.

Speaker 2: 23:30

There's a um small memorial in someone's. You know it's, it's a. It's a state memorial now, but it started um, it started with um just someone putting crosses in his backyard and and so that that's what's important, um that that you never forget. And uh, it's hard, especially, you know, coming into this podcast um, where where things get hard um is when you know you have guys that you serve with um, or or veterans that you you know intimately, um, you know they, they, uh, they passed away uh over the last week or so, and then um, you know which makes you uh, uh, what's. You know it makes you reflect. You know you reflect on um not not reaching out enough, not um, you know um not being available enough. You know what I mean.

Speaker 1: 25:02

And I was thinking about, I was thinking about that on the drive up here today. um, especially those guys you're talking about, they didn't fall in the field of battle, right, But those wars ultimately led to their death.

Speaker 2: 25:15

Yeah, right.

Speaker 1: 25:17

And and the trauma from those wars basically destroyed them.

Speaker 2: 25:23

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 25:23

You know and they'll never. They'll always they'll be remembered by people like you and stuff like that. But they won't get the um ra-ra treatment, um, just because they're not treated as as that type of a war statistic, right.

Speaker 2: 25:42

And and um, it's unfair, it is, it's, it's um, and you know, mission 22 has, um, they dedicated a memorial um, um, and it's called the war at home memorial And it's basically for all who who has succumbed to um suicide And uh, yeah, i mean it's, it's, it's tough And and you know, for uh, david Matt Therese, um, he was my PL's driver, um in 2010,. Um, you know, we we've talked sparingly over the uh, last few years, Um, and that's what that's what's makes you. You fall back. You know what I mean And and say, well, goddamn, i could have did more. You know what I mean And you know, um, and then you find out a few days later that um, chris Briggs, big, excuse me, um, that you served with an O five um, he died, and you're like God dang.

Speaker 2: 27:18

And then, uh, you know, so you're dealing with that And and I went into, you know, a little bit of a funk and uh had to get out on the bike and and take advantage of some some uh good weather here in Ohio and and um, you know, and then this past Sunday, my, my father-in-law, um, tom Smith, um, died unexpectedly. Um, he was a Vietnam veteran.

Speaker 2: 27:56

So, yeah, i mean it's. it's one of those things where, yeah, they didn't die, they didn't die in battle, Um, they didn't fall to the enemy, but they were forever changed by their service. and um, you know Tom, being a Vietnam vet, um, you know he, he had many ailments and he uh just became um 100% disabled, uh, within the last three or four years. and uh, you know, as, as things from the Vietnam era, as you know, age and orange and and all that stuff, um, more comes out about it and and and things of that nature, more veterans are being afforded the opportunity to be, to be taken care of you know, yeah, our neighbor.

Speaker 1: 29:09

When we first moved back to Kishokton, merle and Al Jean um Merle was on a boat in uh, vietnam And you know that for 40 plus years the Navy said in the, in the V, in the VA, and the DOD said if you were on a boat in the Navy you weren't exposed to age and orange. Well, it finally came down the pipeline that not only were guys on boats were exposed to age and orange, but these were the boats If you served on will acknowledge happen to be one of the boats that Merle's on. So for 40 years he's got all this age and orange damage going on to his body And he finally gets the care and and the compensation that he's deserved. Within a couple of years he dies. Yeah, cancer takes him out. Everything that was wrong with him linked back to the years of of hell that age and orange played on his body Again didn't fall into field of battle, but the field of battle ultimately fell him.

Speaker 2: 30:09

Yeah, and you know, i like to say it, there's, there is, you know the statistic 22 a day. Uh, veterans commit suicide. And uh, i was doing a um, a talk up in Columbus, um, at um, a fundraiser They had at the Dougie uh mission 22 event, and um, i was asked by a local radio station like the 22 a day, what are your thoughts? And I'm like, well, just to just me personally, right, i think it's much higher, right, and I think it's much higher because you know there's 40,000 veterans that are homeless and that number is what it is because those are the documented veterans, right, you know? just think, think back, um, you know the, the, the number one demographic in America for veterans suicide is 55 to 75 year old veterans And uh, those are predominantly your Vietnam guys, right, and when, I would go to your um VFW, your Amvets, your American legions and I would speak about the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the veterans suicide, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the veterans suicide.

Speaker 2: 31:48

And I would speak about, you know, mission 22 and about veterans suicide. And uh, a lot of those, a lot of those veterans were like hogwash You know what I mean Like you're not talking about me. And then I I'm like, well, statistics say right, right. And then you say, well, why do you? why do you think that? And I'm like, well, you know, you come back from Vietnam and there's no fanfare, There's no, there's no parades, There's no, uh, people lined up in the airport applauding as you walk through. As many of us who who went to Afghanistan and Iraq experienced, there was none of that. There was actually people lined up to throw things that you call your murderer. Yeah, which you know people, veterans quickly ran into the bathroom in the airport to change their clothes, to get out of uniform, and uh, so you take that experience and you're like, okay, i want nothing, nothing else to do with the government, because the government drafted me, the government sent me over here.

Speaker 1: 33:08

You know the government did nothing when I came home, Right.

Speaker 2: 33:11

The, the government. They prepared me briefly, briefly prepared me to go forth close with destroy the enemy. Once I did that, after 365 days I got to come home and nothing.

Speaker 1: 33:28

We're done with you.

Speaker 2: 33:29

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 33:30

Hard and put away wet Right.

Speaker 2: 33:32

And you know there's veterans that went back to Vietnam repeatedly because they can't adjust to life back home. They can't hold a job, they can't. You know what I mean. Send me back, i'm, i'm, i'm good at that. Send me back. So those veterans from Vietnam, they would come home. They have a disdain for the government, just, you know, a horrible taste in their mouth for what they just did. You know, because now they have everyone saying what they did was ungodly and what they did was unjust, and what they did was horrible, and and and all this stuff.

Speaker 2: 34:13

So what do you do? Well, you go back to the still mill, or you go back to the coal mine, or you go back to, you know, working at the Honda plant or wherever it was. And you were there for the next 30 fucking years And you did exactly what your dad did and what your granddad did. You just worked feelings. Fuck those feelings. You compartmentalized all that shit and you worked yourself tired. You went home, you ate, you fell asleep, You woke up, you did it again for 30 fucking years And all your and all.

Speaker 1: 34:57

By the way, the majority of that population also drank heavily.

Speaker 2: 35:03

Yes.

Speaker 1: 35:04

Right.

Speaker 2: 35:06

So. So, once you're at retirement age, now you get the, now you get to shut work off, but now you're with your thoughts, now you're not working yourself to sleep.

Speaker 1: 35:24

Now, now you're, you know, i mean so now you're dealing with repressed things from 50 years ago.

Speaker 2: 35:31

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 35:31

Yeah, and 50 year old wounds are hard runes to handle, yeah.

Speaker 2: 35:36

You know my, my, my uncle, my uncle Bob, Vietnam veteran. You know he, every time I see me, pulls me aside as the night, you know, has the nightmare started yet you know in early on I'd be like no, because I was still active then, i was still in it.

Speaker 2: 36:00

Then no, he's like they will. And when they do you want to talk? you know he tells a story about um straddling um our aunt with a pistol And uh, you know, that evening she told him Hey, you need it. You know, after that evening you need to get some help. And he did And he still continues to get help And you know it's it goes. It falls back on having that support system, but you know it's. It's one of those things where he worked for so many years.

Speaker 2: 36:46

And you know people, when you're a functioning veteran right, which is air quotes functioning veteran, which you know it's like being a functioning alcoholic, which, uh, uh, them things are intertwined functioning alcoholic, functioning drug addict, functioning, you know um, what, what ever the case may be, you know, when you're a functioning veteran, people don't think your experience was that bad And you know, oh yeah, he served. but you know his experience wasn't that bad. He's not Desmond Doss.

Speaker 1: 37:30

Right, you know, he's not the guys from band of brothers. You know the stuff they see on TV, you know, oh, you, you know, you know. You know you're not the guy who you know. We use me as an example. Oh, you worked a flight line in Afghanistan. Oh, you worked mobile radar and, and and I rapped really Okay. Well, you know you weren't stacking bodies, You weren't saving lives. So, really right, quit whining.

Speaker 2: 37:57

And to which I would. I would combat that with you know, combat, combat, mos is combat Job. You know you're you're trained from basic training to the day before you deploy, and then, once you get in Kuwait, it's a mindset. You're, you're, you're you're killing the frontal lobe. You're, you're killing where, where the the morality is in your brain. You're killing it. You're, you're suppressing it. You're you know you want to. You know you're trying to make what you're about to do Okay And and that, and for a long time, it is okay.

Speaker 1: 39:00

You know they don't make. unlike what the movie show you there, they're not trying to make mindless killers, but they are trying to make a moral killers, because the whole concept of war is immorally wrong. Right, you are killing someone and no matter what religion you, you practice taking a life. it's a no, no.

Speaker 2: 39:23

Right And you know it and I can only speak. How I train my guys is to we're going to train to the point where, if and when you you have to squeeze the trigger, you are 1000% okay with the consequences, and that relieves some of that burden, but you don't, but you don't truly know what the consequences are, until later.

Speaker 1: 40:09

Right, right And and those are the consequences you're not prepared for.

Speaker 2: 40:15

Yeah, you know those, but they help. They help in the quiet times, at least for me they help in the quiet times, you know. I mean I don't have a lot of force on force regret from Iraq, i don't. You know the things. The things I've had trouble with is did I do enough? Did I, you know, think that that sort of thing? Did I do enough? Did I? you know, when I lost Robert Liggett to suicide in 07? It was man did I do enough? Was it because of me? You know the narrative out there was. Well, he did that because you fired him And and at the time in 07, i dismissed that as well. I fired him for the good of the group Right, and then and then followed up the firing with a four hour talking in my room And then the next day he shoots himself, the only the only soldier I ever lost in Iraq, robert Liggett. And that now, when I talk to many of my contemporaries and people I talk to on a regular basis that I serve with, they're like man, you like you know. You talk to the ligates parents. I talked to the ligates parents after it happened, once they were notified, once you know everything, called and gave my condolences And you know his father's. Like you know, he, he was always a struggling, you know, struggling with mental health, struggling, you know, and and you know we took the. We took the right steps, we took the right procedures to not have him go to Iraq. They deemed him okay to go to Iraq. Once we're in Iraq, he did some things. We sent him back to, you know, psychologist, psychiatrist. They deemed him okay to go on mission. You know, um, he had to check in with his team leader every day at a certain time to get his meds, to ensure that he was taking his meds. Like, we did the right thing And you know when, when he, when he shot himself, me and Roy Carr, uh, roy Carr being his squad leader um, rc three.

Speaker 2: 43:51

Um, we were, we were coming back from uh, the chow and we hit, we hit our chew line and our um Liggetts, um chew was butted up. Our rooms were, uh, we were in the same chew and uh separated by a wall and uh, we were at the far end. Our chew was at the far end of the line. There was the? uh, there was the platoon offices in a chew and then the next, the next chew was Liggetts. Then I was adjoined to him, me and uh, uh, old monster, three, seven, um and uh, oh, eddie B and uh.

Speaker 2: 44:44

You know, when me and when me and Carr was walking down the chewed line, we hear the shots. And I say shots because he used a M249, uh squad automatic weapon, belt fed, and you know, and when you, when you pull the trigger, you know several rounds go off, um, until you let go of the trigger. So it could have been much worse. Um and uh. You know, as soon as we heard the shots, we looked at each other and said Liggett, you know what I mean. And uh, we ran down there. Door was locked and uh, you know, we had to pry the door open to get to him. And you know he was, uh, when we got in the room he was still alive, um and uh, you know, it's one of those things where maybe we didn't do everything in our power to save his life.

Speaker 2: 46:02

Then, um, because you know what, what is, what is the? I mean we, i don't. What is the quality of life? right, what? what is? what is the quality of life you have going forward? Um, i don't know. I mean and, and that's what, that's what gets you Did, you do everything. You know, and that's why I say maybe we didn't. I mean we. The age station was right across street. Pote Monaliter got him to the eight. You know what I mean. Like we didn't stand over him and and and or none of that. I mean you know it's it's just second guessing.

Speaker 2: 46:49

Yeah, yeah, and your armchair quarterbacking.

Speaker 1: 46:53

But in that moment, knowing you and knowing the way you train and the way you train your guys, you wouldn't have thought you would have done, and so you would have done the way you were trained. And so there really isn't anything you could have done short of having a medic with you. You know what I mean?

Speaker 2: 47:12

Yeah, I mean it's, it's um, yeah, i mean it's just. It's just that that nagging. And when I tell, you know, when I tell people you know, uh, ligget, Ligget still gets me, you know, ligget, he still gets me, and uh, they're like God damn man, and I'm like I get it, you know what I mean Like I could, i could use the you know his dad saying Hey, he was a problem kid. He had, he had mental issues before the military. We thought the military was straightening him out.

Speaker 1: 47:59

You were given multiple outs, but it's still not going to fix your conscience.

Speaker 2: 48:02

No, because you, like you, gave him to me. Now he's my response. You know what I mean, and I take that responsibility, um, uh, uh, with great pride. Like you know, i can't, i can't, you know. hail all my guys for the great work, great work. they did um in all our deployments and they did um, you know, to ask, to ask someone to get in a vehicle, go out on a road and look for roadside bombs, and half the time, though, those roadside bombs are going to find you, and half the time you're going to find them. And and for the vehicle to take a hit, and you know, and then the very next day, a lot of the times, they get right back in a similar vehicle and go do the same shit. Man, you know the? I don't think the American people understand the sacrifices that veterans make.

Speaker 1: 49:21

We've said it before you don't get to pick your war. That's a politician's job, right. But every veteran, when they raise that right hand and they take that oath of enlistment you know it sounds cliche but in reality it's what it is They sign a blank check up to including your life to serve, to serve. And sometimes the military caches that fucking check.

Speaker 2: 49:48

It's, it's, yeah, it's man, I'll tell you, i, you know it's. It's places like we went to me and Sarge road to, uh, gettysburg um September 2019. Um, maybe in August, something like I mean, it was cold as balls, but uh, it was cold as balls, um, but we went to Gettysburg in 2019, I want to say, and uh, or 2020, regardless, you wasn't there. We went there and you know, we rode our motorcycles over and um slept in tents, um living a good life and um, we got, you know, and it's, it's a, it's a um, if you've never been, it's worth a trip. Um, especially if you're a veteran, you'll be all you're, you're in all.

Speaker 1: 51:00

I'm so into it, so excited to do it this year, right.

Speaker 2: 51:02

You're in all and, politics aside, um, the why aside, um, you know why the civil war happened right, wrong, indifferent. Put all that shit aside, go to a civil war battlefield And especially if you're a veteran and you know anything about small, small group movement tactics. And I remember us um standing. We were standing on a hill, um, and elevated, elevated defensive position, And across the valley where it was, where general picket was, uh, where they did the famous picket's charge. And you know Getty Bird Getty's bird does a great job of having placards there Um, saying exactly what happened or what time.

Speaker 2: 52:11

You know this, that and the other, and you know they have the stops numbered throughout the. You know the first shot in Getty's Berg happened here, at spot one. And then you know you travel around spot two that you know the battle moved here and it moved here and and uh, it, it. You know their placards tell you every unit that was on the battlefield there at that time numbers, all that's, it's, it's great. And you know, sards, being an infantry dude, i'm a combat engineer, um, and we're standing there where the the cannons are, again, on an elevated defensive position, looking down into the valley where, where general picket, they were in their last covered in concealed position, before they made the charge Game In July In wool uniforms on foot, after they marched Hundreds of miles to get there with muskets and shit shoulder to shoulder And you're like These motherfuckers Were told by their commanding officer to charge and that's what the fuck they did.

Speaker 2: 53:55

And You know, i don't, politics aside, i don't need to know shit else about you. I Mean, they say that Civil War it was fought over slavery. What, whatever? whatever your view on that is, have your view. I'm telling you, except for my immediate family, i Don't know if I could make that charge With the conviction in my heart because I hated Another human being so bad that I didn't even fucking know That's my. You know, i mean, that's my thing. Like the, the South was wrong. Okay, all right, i Would say that the educated people in the South were wrong. However, the masses? they didn't have Twitter, they didn't have Facebook, they didn't get their fucking Un-unfactual information.

Speaker 1: 55:26

Oh, it's just like the Vietnam guys that they were conscripted.

Speaker 2: 55:30

Right, but what I'm saying is these guys, these guys in in 1860, they got on horseback, they went to a town hall meeting Where the most educated person in the town, be it, be it the mayor or be it the priest, told them Hey, this is what's going on and this is how you should think about it. And Those young men said, yeah, that sounds bad, we're gonna do that. And they made their mark. And then they marched hundreds of fucking miles To meet up on a battlefield in in southern Pennsylvania and Fight Like they're defending Their freedom. Yep, and the other thing too is especially with those guys.

Speaker 1: 56:44

People fail to understand that they are considered American veterans. Right, that They weren't fighting for another country. You know the secession never actually took place As far as becoming a separate entity, you know, i mean like it wasn't recognized as another country. It's not like they were, you know, fucking soldiers from a different, different country coming in and invading their American veterans. So, no matter what you say about them, no, they're American veterans and that's all we need to know, right, exactly. And and you know Again, you want to take down.

Speaker 2: 57:24

General Graham's Statue? take it down. You want to take down general Lee statue? take it down. You want again these. You know, these people, these people were educated, west Point educated. They made an educational A, a, a, a, a, a, a Informed decision To choose a side. You know, general General Lee chose Virginia, right, the Commonwealth of Virginia and and General Grant. Then, you know, he eventually became In charge of all of the Union Army. I mean, they made Educated decisions. There's there's posts That are being renamed.

Speaker 2: 58:31

They have been at this point yeah, that have been renamed And I have zero issue. Zero issue, right With renaming posts, because those people, those, those veterans that those posts were named after, made an informed decision of You know on what side they were gonna be on.

Speaker 1: 59:06

But leave. Leave the memorials alone for private. John Smith, corporal Bob Smith Yeah, those guys, the memorials to them Isn't for any type of celebratory thing, it's like we said, just so they're not forgotten.

Speaker 2: 59:25

Yes, and you know They're, they were doing what they think thought was right Was right, and Yeah, and, and they deserve their flowers as well, and Just, you know, just to bring it back. You know It took a hundred years. It took a hundred years for Memorial Day To become a federal holiday. A hundred years, you know, in 1868. That's when, you know, decoration day was first established, and You know, in order to Pay respect to those that died during the Civil War and United States Congress, you know they passed laws that that Acknowledge that everyone who fought in the Civil War is an American veteran and should be treated as such. And Yeah, and, and that's all, and That's all you know this day means.

Speaker 1: 1:01:03

Yeah, as an Ohio kid and an Air Force guy, air Force Medal of Honor recipients there's not a lot of them and they don't get the love that your more combat oriented type branches get. But when I was in Germany, when you go from E 40 E 5, you have to go to something called airman leadership school And the one where I was at in Germany was called the Pittsburgh Leadership school and I learned about William Pittsburgh. Like I said, being an Air Force guy, being an Ohio kid, this guy really resonated with me. Plus, he did something that I really wish I would have been able to do. But William Pitts and Barger he was born 19. Oh, hold on, before I get started about him, i remembered Ray was killed in Afghanistan October 19th 2011. I want to make sure I got that that the year right. But William Pitts and Barger, born July 8th 1944, died April 11th 1966, 21 year old kid. He was a PJ para rescue and And Vietnam he was. He was a participant in almost 300 met rescue missions Aiding down soldiers and pilots. Think about that 21 year old kid 300 rescue missions in Vietnam. He died On April 11th 1966, pittsburgh was killed aiding and defending a unit of soldiers pinned down by an enemy assault during the Vietnam War. Before his death He helped save over 60 men in the battle. He was posthumously awarded the Air Force Cross, which was later upgraded to the Medal of Honor.

Speaker 1: 1:02:52

Like to understand what these guys did? You know, helicopters would fly in and these guys would, would basically Have time. The helicopter couldn't even land. You know they'd fast-rope down or, you know, get low and jump, or however You dismount from a fucking Huey in Vietnam. But these guys were were not only, you know, combatants, you know, but they were also rescuers. So you know they're, they're tending aid, they're engaging the enemy, and there was quite a few of them. But like I said, hi, okay, this one just kind of kind of hit me. I want to read this little blurb here about the the whole thing here.

Speaker 1: 1:03:37

On April 11th 1966, the joint rescue center dispatched two huskies from detachment six to extract a half dozen or more Army casualties pinned down in a battle near Cam Mai, 35 miles east of Saigon. Upon reaching the side of the ambush, he was lowered through the trees to the ground where he had tended to the wind wounded, before having them lifted to the helicopter by cable after six wounded men had been flown to an aid station, the two US Air Force helicopters returned for their second load. As one of the helicopters lowered It's litter basket to pit some barger who had remained on the ground with the 20 in from infantry men still alive, it was hit by a burst of enemy small arms fire. When its engine began to lose power, the pilot realized he had to get the helicopter away from the area as soon as possible Instead of climbing into the litter basket so he could leave at the helicopter. Pits and barger elected to remain with the army troops under enemy attack And he gave a way up wave off to the helicopter, which flew away to safety With heavy mortar and small arms fire. The helicopters could not return to rescue pits and barger. For the next hour and a half, pits and barger tended to the wounded soldiers, hacking splints out of the snarled vines and building improvised stretchers out of saplings. When the others began running low on ammunition, he gathered ammo from the dead and distributed it to those still alive. Then he joined the others with a rifle to hold off the vietcong Pits and barger was killed by vietcong snipers later that night. When his body was recovered the next day, one hand Still held a rifle and the other clutched a medical kid, although bits of pits and barger did not escape alive.

Speaker 1: 1:05:03

60 other men did Like I got goosebumps, like like that's fucking gangster, you know, and a 21 year old kid to have that kind of Like his fatigues. They had to put a hell of a gusset in there for that kid to be able to fucking put his balls in when he put his Fatigue's on To be able to jump out of a helicopter like that down into the jungle and then tell the helicopter I know this is probably gonna fuck me, but you get out of here. I got a job to do. You know, whether you, whatever your feelings about anything is, appreciate The dedication and the service and the sacrifice that a 20 year old, 21 year old kid had a fucking pick while Ohio Did in the jungles of fucking Vietnam to save some guys That he didn't know But wore the same flag on their uniforms and then that's that right there. Guys like that are The reason that Monday exists most certainly yeah, and it's, it's, you know, they.

Speaker 2: 1:06:21

They often say you know the Medal of Honor. There's a thin line between a Medal of Honor and a general court martial. I mean like You know, because a lot of times people were, or you know, disobeying a Directive to you know, save themselves and Things of that nature.

Speaker 1: 1:06:49

You know, the PJ motto is so others may live yeah. And he. The other thing I forgot to mention is he was the first enlisted guy to get the Air Force Cross. Typically it only went to officers, pilots, things like that. So I mean, you know, you know that that's huge right there, so others may live.

Speaker 2: 1:07:11

Yeah, i mean, so others may live. Yeah, it's, it's. It's one of those things where You know When, when you do, when, when you're cut from that cloth, when that is your DNA, you know that It would be harder to live with yourself if you didn't. You know, i mean, if you didn't go in it would be harder to live with yourself. Yeah, i Would be remissed if, since we're bringing up metal of honor recipients Alwyn Cash metal of honor recipient Serve with him. He was in First of the 15th inventory On Kelly Hill Fort Benning, georgia, third brigade, third ID. We served together. He was a Platoon Sergeant, infantryman.

Speaker 2: 1:08:46

In October 2000 excuse me, 2005, october 17, 2005, and Samaro rack Is Bradley fighting vehicle was struck by an improvised explosive device. The Bradley caught on fire and Drenched in diesel fuel, so in cash Retrieved six soldiers in Iraqi interpreter from the burning vehicle, receiving burns over 72% of his body. So, on cash died November 8, 2005. You know there's, there's, there's soldiers out there That feel the same way I do, that their existence is Is Directly coordinated, correlated to a sacrifice of another veteran. And, yeah, so he just received The metal of honor last year after years, years and years of Debates and 17 years it took for them to understand, for them to accept that he, he deserved it yeah, and.

Speaker 1: 1:10:42

Man, that's crazy.

Speaker 2: 1:10:43

Yeah, and well, he Finally received it last year, and so You know some, some justice was served his family you know, and and Deep thank you goes to his family.

Speaker 1: 1:11:03

Yeah, not only you know the sacrifice of them losing their husband, son, father, but also to spend 17 years making sure that The army, the Department of Defense and and everybody knows and remembers Who he was, what he did and how he sacrificed himself To make sure that guys in that Bradley got out.

Speaker 2: 1:11:37

Yeah, and, and You know it's, it's. It's one of those things where You think when you're thrust in a situation like that, you're gonna make the right decision. You think When you're You're put in a situation. You know we say a lot, you know we say it all the time. You know I'd I'd run through a brick wall for you, i'd run through a hell gunfire, i'd run in. I mean you say it all the time to to make someone Understand, try to understand what they mean to you, and For for those people to actually do it, to actually Put others above themselves, to to Yeah, that that is the epitome. And and no thanks enough can be given. But you know, since we're It, it it's only fitting on on this, this episode, that we talk about Sarncash and Didn't know him. Well, we wasn't, wasn't buddies, didn't hang out and drink, but he didn't have to. But we knew, i knew, we knew each other through the platoon Sarn circles, up on up on Kelly Hill.

Speaker 2: 1:13:27

He was a brother, most certainly most certainly, and you know, i, and it was so, so close to home, right, so close to Resonated with Everyone up on Kelly Hill. Kelly Hill is a, is a institution to itself In the, in the lore of the third infantry division, in the lore of Fort Moore now that it's called, not for betting anymore In the lore of Fort Moore, kelly Hills, you know, stood by itself and at one time the third brigade, third ID, was the most deployed brigade in the army. And And And those, those, those people up on Kelly Hill, or some of the finest Human beings well, i don't know about human beings so Some of the finest veterans, their human being, this Could handle some work, but you know you, you put them, you put them in a fight and there's nobody better, and and starting cash being one of them so earlier, when you were talking about Liggett, it reminded me.

Speaker 1: 1:14:56

If you're you're battling suicidal thoughts, you're thinking about it, whatever it is, they finally, you know, figured out giving it a 15 digit phone number for people to call when they're having suicidal thoughts. It's kind of a dumbass idea. So if you're dealing with any of that shit, you don't need that. You need three numbers 988. If you're a veteran, choose option one, they'll get you the veteran crisis line. If you don't want to call somebody, text 988. They'll text you back, you know. So just Three numbers, man. If you're thinking about it, type three numbers on your phone, hit the button. Those three numbers might be the difference between you being here today and you being here tomorrow.

Speaker 2: 1:15:39

Yeah, and, and you know There there is time to be remembered, there's time, and, and you know what I'll tell you is Like I used to tell my squad don't be in a rush to die. Slow, smooth, smooth as fast. Live your life. Don't be in a rush to die because people are in a rush to kill you. So you know when you, when you're entering and clearing a room, don't be in a rush to die. Don't be, don't be so Gung-ho to go in and kill the enemy That you allow the opening for the enemy to kill you. Take that same approach with life. Don't be, don't be in a rush to die because we're all dying, the end Are all. Our days are numbered. So don't be in a rush. Live your life To give Others a chance to remember you for that. And and Yeah live your life.

Speaker 2: 1:17:00

I think it's appropriate that, as we roll out from this episode, we read all those names again most certainly and and I Mean it's it's one of those things where I I know them all and I served with them all and I remember them all and, and you know, lieutenant Carlos Diaz, staff Sergeant Harrison Brown, staff Sergeant Michael Moody Jr, staff Sergeant James Snyder, sergeant Dane Dunlaw, corporal Marvin Snyder, pfc Gregory Huxley Jr. And.

Speaker 1: 1:18:06

Chief Petty Officer, raymond J Porter.

Speaker 2: 1:18:09

Yeah, and, and you know All those, all those, and, like I said, i wouldn't, i wouldn't cash. Sorry, first-class, i wouldn't cash, i Mean and William Pitsenbarger.

Speaker 2: 1:18:29

Yeah, and, and you know, and the 387 others, if you go to Fort Stewart, georgia, home of the Third Infantry Division, they have what they call the warrior walk. And every time I go To my sisters, you know I have to make a trip up the Fort Stewart and I have to walk the warrior walk. And From the time that the invasion started in 03 to The time the war in Iraq, in Afghanistan, is complete, completed, fort Stewart planted a tree For every member of the Third Infantry Division or attachments, who died In comment. So there's, you know, over 400 trees on the warrior walk and You know it's important for me to go there every time. And these guys I just mentioned, they're there, they have a tree. Under the tree is a flag, the flag of their brigade that they were in, and a headstone, and You know, family comes and they drop Memorabilia and and and things of that nature. And you know, yeah, so Every time I'm down at Fort Stewart, i, i go to the warrior walk, it's, it's very humbling.

Speaker 2: 1:20:19

Much is, you know, the, the, the wall in Illinois to the wall in Washington, the wall up, and we have here in Ohio, it's, it's. We can never forget the sacrifices that men and women had made for us, and, and I think if we remember a little more of those sacrifices, some of the nonsense that's going on Can be alleviate. You know, and and you know, you look around and you're like man. You know some of them. Some of them might say I died for this. So you know, take.

Speaker 1: 1:21:08

Before you, before you eat your hamburger, your hot dog or whatever it is on Monday, take a moment, think about the guys that we named. Think about the guys that you know, the ladies that you know That lost their lives in combat. Just say thank you. You don't need anything flashy, you know. Just just acknowledge them, memorialize them and then have fun and celebrate the life that they paid For you to enjoy. Yeah, i'm in way, shape or form.

Speaker 2: 1:21:43

It's, it's. You know. There's an organization that's doing a Challenge a hundred mile ride. Wounded Warrior project is doing a hundred mile challenge to ride on your motorcycle and I don't I don't know how this came up on my feed. I don't support Wounded Warrior project, but it came up on my feed and So I started reading the comments and in the comments there's people were. You know.

Speaker 2: 1:22:22

Oh, I ride a hundred miles to work you know I, it should be a hundred miles a day for the four days, or whatever, and and So, after I read about 20 or so comments, but there's 530 comments, when I, when I comment, there was already 500. Now all of them wasn't. You know, people are like well, i'm riding to Washington for Rolling Thunder On my way home, all set aside a hundred miles for that. That's exactly what it's for, exactly what it's for. You know, for those out there that were saying That ain't enough, oh, a hundred miles, that's a drop in a bucket, you know, to which I say you're not riding, we're doing. We're doing 200 miles. Monday, we're doing the seven lakes. Here in Southeast Ohio, we do the seven lakes. This is our third year doing it.

Speaker 2: 1:23:34

We're not riding for us that day. We're riding for everyone who can't ride, and The mileage is a metaphor. The mileage is irrelevant if it's 50 miles, a hundred miles, a thousand miles, whatever the hell it is that's irrelevant. You're riding because you can't, because you're alive, because you survived, if you're able and living. Do something to honor. Do something to honor the memory of, of everyone in this country who answered the call and Perished For this country. Couldn't said better myself and we'll see y'all next time. Happy Memorial Day.